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Post by humbleopinion on Mar 30, 2008 8:57:41 GMT -5
As I was reading the JUCO thread, this question came to mind. Other than the boys from Valpo in the nineties (Smith, Redmon, Schmidt, and Drew) have their been any other VU players from Porter County in the DivI era?
What about Lake County?
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Post by valpo89 on Mar 30, 2008 10:29:59 GMT -5
Well, you can start with Mike Jones (VHS 1986) and Scott Anselm (VHS 1985), and Rob Cavanaugh (VHS 1990). Todd Smith graduated from high school in 1984 and redshirted a year. I believe he is a long-time assistant coach at Rice.
John Meyne, I believe, is the only Boone Grove player other than Aric Graham to play at VU. Aric walked on for two years, and then finished a decent career at, I believe, Purdue Cal.
Marc Massa from Chesterton played a couple years at VU in the later 80s. I don't believe there have been any players from Portage, although it would have been nice to get Jim (The Gorilla) Havrilla who had a very good career at Western Michigan and I think played against VU his senior year. I'm thinking that Bryce is the last VHS graduate to play for the Crusaders, although it would have been nice to have seen Brent Kimmel get a chance to play for VU. He just wrapped up a very good career at Southern Nazarene in Oklahoma.
I don't think there have been any players from Kouts, Morgan, Washington or Hebron who would have been good enough to play here, at least since the late 80s. There were probably a couple who THINK they could have, but they would have been mistaken.
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Post by indyvalpo on Mar 30, 2008 11:51:58 GMT -5
Gregg Mostello was also from Boone Grove. And do not forget the brief appearance of Rob Harden.
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Post by valpo89 on Mar 30, 2008 14:35:08 GMT -5
Great calls - I knew there was another old-time name from Boone Grove. And how can I forget Rob Harden? His name came up with my running buddies this morning when discussing players who may have gotten away with a few off-the-court distractions while in high school.
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Post by bigmosmithfan on Apr 1, 2008 10:12:57 GMT -5
Ah, Rob Harden... the guy responsible for the biggest let-down of the Tom Smith Era. He transferred in from Florida, and VU started out like a house on fire, beating St. Louis and one of Dick Versace's excellent Bradley teams to run up an 8-3 record or thereabouts. Then, during a game against Eastern Kentucky, Harden got into a shouting match with the coaching staff, dropping f-bombs loud enough for the crowd at Hilltop Gym to hear. Harden was suspended, and a week later he was gone. The team then spiraled into their normal 1980s selves, losing 13 of their last 17.
Coach Smith was too strong to admit it publicly, but that whole debacle was just a vicious setback for his program. The team was set to move into the ARC the following year with a hometown boy and former Indiana All-Star leading the way. And Harden's presence was helping to get VU looks from several other top recruits in the area. Just a massive disappointment for everyone involved with the program at the time.
Back to the original topic... we've had plenty of players from the area in 70s and 80s. Jeff Markle from Merrillville, Jerome Battle from E.C. Central, Scott Bluhm from Oregon-Davis. Wasn't Jeff Simmons from the Region, as well?
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Post by valpo89 on Apr 1, 2008 15:18:24 GMT -5
Jeff Simmons doesn't ring a bell.
If you're going to go beyond Porter County, you've got to include the Michigan City guys (Shanon Flavin, Tracy Gipson, Geoff Gilmore) and LaPorte (Joel Beesley, one of my all-time favorites, and of course Greg Tonagel).
As for Harden, I was very disappointed as well. I grew up watching him in high school and was thrilled that he came back to VU from Florida. So all of that was a big letdown and you're probably right, it did set back recruiting which eventually led to Smith leaving and Homer taking over. Maybe if Harden had stuck around, Smith may have been able to recruit some size (and more talent) to compete in the old Mid-Con which is essentially now the Horizon.
You mention him letting the F bombs fly, I thought there was also a hand gesture intended for assistant coach Dick Flick.
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Post by CO_VU_Fan on Apr 1, 2008 16:09:35 GMT -5
I recall the hand gesture as well! It was funny seeing Rob the next year while watching the NCAA tournament. I was watching a game and said to myself, I know that long armed guard. It was Rob playing for Nevada-Reno.
What I recall of the Smith era was that he was not respected by the players as a coach, mainly coaching style. After the Harden incident, Smith had his best recruiting class while at VU. Harry Bell was in that class and played professionally in Europe for many years. The headliner of the class was Larry Dougherty, I believe. He quit basketball and VU, not even transferring. I can't remember the others, but think that a few transferred. Rick Pickren, from a few years before and all-newcomer team as freshman in the AMCU-8, transferred out to somewhere in New Mexico. Smith did not have a good record of keeping quality Div I athletes. Harden had his own problems, but Smith was not cut out for Div I basketball at VU. He has had very good success in Division II or III (not sure) in MO.
When I was in HS, Homer was coaching Bethel to NCCAA final fours, and getting good press in SB. Some of the ND basketball players were supposedly spotted going to some of the games - fans of the program so to speak. Know Homer's resume with Bethel and LSU, I was quite pleased when VU announced his hire. After a few rough years, Homer used the talent in the region to bring respectability to the basketball program, and then some.
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Post by valpo84 on Apr 1, 2008 16:51:49 GMT -5
Yeah, that was a memorable night at Hilltop when Rob went off. I remember him being taken out, and as he headed to the water fountain at the one end of the gym (there wasn't high tech coolers in those days), he seemed to be "walking it off," but then we went "did he just flip off the coach" and you knew right then and there that this was going to be the end for Rob at VU. Meanwhile Roger was playing for a UK team that would play in the Final 4 in 1984.
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Post by indyvalpo on Apr 1, 2008 19:26:26 GMT -5
Jeff Simmons was a solid 6-6 forward from Highland. I believe.
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Post by valpospartan on Apr 1, 2008 22:25:44 GMT -5
Jeff Simmons was a solid 6-6 forward from Highland. I believe. Later, I believe, he became a HS referee in the area. |
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Post by bigmosmithfan on Apr 2, 2008 10:44:56 GMT -5
What I recall of the Smith era was that he was not respected by the players as a coach, mainly coaching style. After the Harden incident, Smith had his best recruiting class while at VU. Harry Bell was in that class and played professionally in Europe for many years. The headliner of the class was Larry Dougherty, I believe. He quit basketball and VU, not even transferring. I can't remember the others, but think that a few transferred. Rick Pickren, from a few years before and all-newcomer team as freshman in the AMCU-8, transferred out to somewhere in New Mexico. Smith did not have a good record of keeping quality Div I athletes. Harden had his own problems, but Smith was not cut out for Div I basketball at VU. He has had very good success in Division II or III (not sure) in MO. Good point... Smith was a "my way or the highway" type of guy, to his and the program's detriment at times. He lost a couple of players over some really minor arguments that became larger ones when he escalated them into a Battle of Wills and refused to budge or move past the issue. While that worked fine with Division II guys who were often just happy to be playing organized hoops, it didn't work well with the psychology of Division I players. To be fair to Smith, though, the program was really run on a shoestring back then. Smith had almost no resources with which to recruit (he often had to borrow vans from friends of the program to do any long-distance recruiting trips, because plane flights and hotel rooms were out of the question) and a lousy, aging bandbox gym that was worse than half the high schools in the area. The team uniforms never had players' names on the back of them, because it would have cost too much money to replace them every season. Given those constraints and Valpo's place in the hoops world at the time, Smith couldn't land the stable types of kids that Homer has. Smith had to take a lot of chances on talented head-cases and other guys who were projects in the rawest sense of the term. Some of you younger fans and alums don't recall those days, but trust me, the program was a different world back then. We had only been Division I for less than a decade, never had come close to a winning season, drew a few hundred fans at most to home games and got zero, and I do mean zero, media coverage outside of Valpo's city limits -- in fact, there was a writer at the old Vidette-Messenger who used to make an annual column out of calling for VU to drop out of Divsion I. The program was about as far off the college basketball radar as you could be and still field a team. Oh, and Harry Bell is still one of my all-time favorite Crusaders... |
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Post by wh on Apr 2, 2008 12:16:10 GMT -5
No question Rob Harden was a hothead in high school and college, but many of us go through phases like that as part of growing up. I'm guessing he would be well entrenched in middle age now - about 45 years old. Does anyone know anything about him currently?
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Post by valpo89 on Apr 2, 2008 13:55:07 GMT -5
No question Rob Harden was a hothead in high school and college, but many of us go through phases like that as part of growing up. I'm guessing he would be well entrenched in middle age now - about 45 years old. Does anyone know anything about him currently? I'm pretty sure that Rob and his younger brother Rodney are in Crawfordsville. Their dad ended up there, for some reason. I believe they may run a gym that hosts some AAU events in the summer. I think I saw Rob at a Kouts game in the last year because a cousin/friend of the family played for Kouts the last two seasons (Kyle Mueller). |
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Post by cornonthe on Apr 2, 2008 14:22:59 GMT -5
What I recall of the Smith era was that he was not respected by the players as a coach, mainly coaching style. After the Harden incident, Smith had his best recruiting class while at VU. Harry Bell was in that class and played professionally in Europe for many years. The headliner of the class was Larry Dougherty, I believe. He quit basketball and VU, not even transferring. I can't remember the others, but think that a few transferred. Rick Pickren, from a few years before and all-newcomer team as freshman in the AMCU-8, transferred out to somewhere in New Mexico. Smith did not have a good record of keeping quality Div I athletes. Harden had his own problems, but Smith was not cut out for Div I basketball at VU. He has had very good success in Division II or III (not sure) in MO. Good point... Smith was a "my way or the highway" type of guy, to his and the program's detriment at times. He lost a couple of players over some really minor arguments that became larger ones when he escalated them into a Battle of Wills and refused to budge or move past the issue. While that worked fine with Division II guys who were often just happy to be playing organized hoops, it didn't work well with the psychology of Division I players. To be fair to Smith, though, the program was really run on a shoestring back then. Smith had almost no resources with which to recruit (he often had to borrow vans from friends of the program to do any long-distance recruiting trips, because plane flights and hotel rooms were out of the question) and a lousy, aging bandbox gym that was worse than half the high schools in the area. The team uniforms never had players' names on the back of them, because it would have cost too much money to replace them every season. Given those constraints and Valpo's place in the hoops world at the time, Smith couldn't land the stable types of kids that Homer has. Smith had to take a lot of chances on talented head-cases and other guys who were projects in the rawest sense of the term. Some of you younger fans and alums don't recall those days, but trust me, the program was a different world back then. We had only been Division I for less than a decade, never had come close to a winning season, drew a few hundred fans at most to home games and got zero, and I do mean zero, media coverage outside of Valpo's city limits -- in fact, there was a writer at the old Vidette-Messenger who used to make an annual column out of calling for VU to drop out of Divsion I. The program was about as far off the college basketball radar as you could be and still field a team. Oh, and Harry Bell is still one of my all-time favorite Crusaders... Yep, I remember those days...my Dad was a friend of the program back then. Sometimes, we would go visit the "basketball offices", and I was a little kid, but I knew enough to know who was nice. The players were usually great, but Coach Smith was not very nice. His office was nothing more than a walk in closet...I remember that very well. My Dad and I couldn't go in(too small), so he came out of his office every time to shake my Dad's hand. I remember Mo Smith, he was very nice...he ALWAYS remembered me and said hi. Julian Hudson and John McIllvaine were always smiling and would try to get me to play around with them...I think that Oren Dillard was a part of that too!!! Later on, I remember those really good recruits that he got. Someone mentioned Larry Dougherty...he was great. He quit basketball, don't know why, but he stayed at VU for a year, then went back home to Kansas. The others in that recruiting class were Brian Hubbard from South Bend, and Kelvin and Ron Henderson(not related)...and there was someone else. Larry Dougherty was BY FAR the best recruit that we got in the 80's. I always wished he gave basketball more of a chance. Anyway, that's all I can remember right now... |
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Post by valpo84 on Apr 2, 2008 14:23:54 GMT -5
Rob was part of a pretty good 1981 Indiana All-Star Roster: 1981 Dan Palombizio, Michigan City Rogers (1) Rob Harden, Valparaiso Mike Ballenger, Jasper Doug Crook, Vincennes Ron Brandenburg, Warsaw Dan Dakich, Andrean Jeff Robinson, Indianapolis Broad Ripple Larry Schellenberg, Floyd Central John Flowers, Fort Wayne South Winston Morgan, Anderson Madison Heights Rick Rowray, Muncie Central Dave Bennett, New Albany Speaking of Valpo High basketball, there is apparantly a book being written about its history. nwi.com/articles/2007/12/26/sports/indiana_prep_sports/docd8b4cda57dd0563f862573bb0074bca9.txt |
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