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Post by agibson on Nov 8, 2010 15:08:09 GMT -5
While I'm thinking of it, here's this season's Mid-Major Top 25 thread. Edit: copying in the table format from last season. For now these results are all 2009-2010. I'll consider updating the table as I have idle moments. | Nov 2 | 16 | 23 | 30 | Dec 7 | 14 | 21 | 28 | Jan 4 | 11 | 18 | 25 | Feb 1 | Feb 8 | Feb 15 | Feb 22 | Mar 1 | 8 | - | Butler | 1 | 1 | 1 | 2 | 1 | 2 | 1 | 3 | 3 | 3 | 3 | 2 | Wright State | 9 | 14 | 13 | 20 | 14 | 18 | 19 | 18 | 18 | 20 | RV | RV | Detroit | RV | RV | 20 | 22 | 17 | 21 | 22 | 23 | 24 | 25 | RV | RV | Green Bay | RV | RV | RV | RV | 25 | 23 | 20 | 22 | 22 | RV | RV | 24 |
also received votes at least once: Cleveland State, Milwaukee, Loyola (Chicago)
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Post by agibson on Nov 8, 2010 15:09:16 GMT -5
UPDATED: Nov. 1, 2010 Next Update: Nov. 15, 2010 Record Points Previous 1. Butler (16) 0-0 752 1 2. Gonzaga (15) 0-0 723 7 3. Wichita State 0-0 651 13 4. Old Dominion 0-0 636 5 5. Murray State 0-0 527 6 6. Wofford 0-0 477 10 7. Northern Iowa 0-0 418 2 8. Oakland 0-0 396 9 9. Missouri State 0-0 390 24 10. Fairfield 0-0 360 NR 11. St. Mary's 0-0 333 3 12. UC Santa Barbara 0-0 300 25 13. Ohio 0-0 298 NR 14. VCU 0-0 294 21 15. North Texas 0-0 273 17 16. George Mason 0-0 266 NR 17. Western Kentucky 0-0 236 NR 18. Creighton 0-0 212 NR 19. Weber State 0-0 209 16 20. Siena 0-0 190 8 21. Loyola Marymount 0-0 189 NR 22. Coastal Carolina 0-0 170 14 23. Detroit 0-0 153 NR 24. Appalachian State 0-0 145 23 25. Cleveland State 0-0 127 NR OTHERS RECEIVING VOTES: Long Beach State 106, Iona 104, Akron 61, Pacific 57, Princeton 55, Sam Houston State 53, Kent State 51, Morgan State 50, Stephen F. Austin 49, College of Charleston 48, Belmont 47, Morehead State 47, Ball State 42, East Tennessee State 40, Portland 35, Montana 33, Stony Brook 31, Milwaukee 29, Wright State 28, Quinnipiac 27, Boston University 26, Cornell 26, Illinois State 24, Davidson 23, Central Michigan 22, Harvard 21, Bradley 20, Lipscomb 17, Denver 16, IUPUI 15, Jackson State 13, Northeastern 13, Valparaiso 13, William & Mary 12, Green Bay 12, James Madison 10, Texas-San Antonio 10, South Alabama 9, Lafayette 8, Miami 7, American 6, Middle Tennessee 5, Western Carolina 5, Florida Atlantic 4, Lehigh 4, Eastern Michigan 3, Arkansas-Little Rock 2, Arkansas State 2, Montana State 2, Northern Colorado 2, Robert Morris 2, Cal State Fullerton 1, Holy Cross 1, South Dakota 1. VOTING PANEL: Jesse Agel (Brown), Randy Bennett (St. Mary's), Milan Brown (Holy Cross), Will Brown (Albany), Rick Byrd (Belmont), Dave Calloway (Monmouth), Kermit Davis (Middle Tennessee), Billy Donlon (Wright State), James Fox (Davidson), Tyler Geving (Portland State), Mike Gillian (Longwood), Steve Hawkins (Western Michigan), Dick Hunsaker (Utah Valley), Greg Kampe (Oakland), Danny Kaspar (Stephen F. Austin), Kerry Keating (Santa Clara), Billy Kennedy (Murray State), Jim Larranaga (George Mason), Mike Lonergan (Vermont), Gregg Marshall (Wichita State), Greg McDermott (Creighton), Tom Moore (Quinnipiac), Gregg Nibert (Presbyterian), Jimmy Patsos (Loyola MD), Buzz Peterson (UNC Wilmington), Vann Pettaway (Alabama A&M), Clifford Reed, Jr. (Bethune Cookman), John Shulman (Chattanooga), Brad Stevens (Butler), Gary Stewart (UC Davis), Ernie Zeigler (Central Michigan)
* Longwood head coach Mike Gillian is the chairman of the Top 25 voting panel for the 2010-11 season. NOTE: The Mid-Major Poll is made up of teams from the following conferences: America East, Atlantic Sun, Big Sky, Big South, Big West, Colonial, Great West, Horizon, Independents, Ivy, Metro Atlantic, Mid-American, Mid-Eastern, Missouri Valley, Northeast, Ohio Valley, Patriot, Southern, Southland, Southwestern, Summit, Sun Belt, West Coast. The CollegeInsider.Com Mid-Major Top 25 is now in its twlefth season of existence.
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Post by blackpantheruwm on Nov 9, 2010 15:44:01 GMT -5
I just can't get into that poll. How can you call it "mid-major" and include teams in low-major conferences?
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Post by valporun on Nov 10, 2010 0:36:45 GMT -5
I just can't get into that poll. How can you call it "mid-major" and include teams in low-major conferences? A strange concept we like to call "hype"...
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Post by agibson on Nov 10, 2010 5:42:06 GMT -5
If there are "low-major" teams that are better than "mid-major" teams, why not? I think of it more like a Whelliston divide. The BCS-type schools and everyone else. The "Other 25" conferences he calls them. Even if the Mid-Major Top 25 uses a somewhat different division.
Mostly I like it as the one poll I know of likely to include more than one Horizon League team. And, it's fun to help think of how we square off against other smaller conferences, etc, etc.
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Post by stlvufan on Nov 10, 2010 13:07:29 GMT -5
I just can't get into that poll. How can you call it "mid-major" and include teams in low-major conferences? The same way that mid-major conferences are represented in the USA Today/Coaches Top-25 poll. If TAMU-CC is good enough, there's no reason why you can't vote for them. If they're not, why do you care?
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Post by agibson on Nov 23, 2010 4:32:48 GMT -5
Before it disappears into the mists: UPDATED: Nov. 15, 2010
1. Gonzaga (20) 2-0 755 2 2. Butler (11) 1-0 753 1 3. Old Dominion 0-1 620 4 3. Wichita State 0-0 620 3 5. Murray State 0-0 591 5 6. St. Mary's 1-0 543 11 7. Missouri State 1-0 489 9 8. George Mason 1-0 411 16 9. Northern Iowa 0-1 387 7 10. Wofford 0-1 380 6 11. Fairfield 1-0 375 10 12. Oakland 0-1 357 8 13. Creighton 2-0 310 18 14. VCU 1-0 294 14 15. Western Kentucky 1-0 274 17 16. Cleveland State 3-0 270 25 17. Portland 3-0 267 NR 18. Ohio 1-0 248 13 19. College of Charleston 1-1 229 NR 20. Coastal Carolina 2-0 212 22 21. North Texas 1-0 201 15 22. Weber State 0-1 171 19 23. Appalachian State 1-0 138 23 24. Morgan State 1-0 80 NR 24. North Dakota State 2-1 80 NR OTHERS RECEIVING VOTES: Siena 79, UC Santa Barbara 74, Lipscomb 72, Detroit 55, Morehead State 55, Pacific 53, Loyola Marymount 50, Akron 49, Wright State 48, Sam Houston State 46, Princeton 39, IUPUI 39, Stephen F Austin 39, James Madison 36, Kent State 34, Long Beach State 34, American 27, Illinois State 23, Stetson 23, Northeastern 22, South Dakota State 19, Montana State 17, Vermont 15, Ball State 14, Belmont 12, Texas San Antonio 10, Austin Peay 8, Quinnipiac 7, East Tennessee State 6, Middle Tennessee State 5, Valparaiso 4, Robert Morris 3, Penn 2, South Dakota 1.
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Post by agibson on Nov 23, 2010 4:34:53 GMT -5
Like voters everywhere, they like wins. CSU climbs from #16 to #7. Loyola from NR to #14 (anyone think that's going to last?). Ohio slips to #20. Oakland hangs in at #12.
UPDATED: Nov. 22, 2010 1. Gonzaga (18) 2-1 743 1 2. Butler (7) 2-1 739 2 3. Old Dominion (1) 3-1 676 3 3. Wichita State (2) 1-0 653 4 5. St. Mary's (3) 4-0 625 6 6. Murray State 2-1 529 5 7. Cleveland State 5-0 515 16 8. VCU 3-0 451 14 9. Missouri State 2-2 450 7 10. George Mason 2-2 431 8 11. Wofford 2-3 373 10 12. Oakland 1-2 338 12 13. Creighton 3-1 329 13 14. Loyola (Chicago) 5-0 312 NR 15. Rider 4-1 295 NR 16. Kent State 4-1 268 NR 17. Portland 4-1 245 17 18. College of Charleston 4-2 223 19 19. Western Kentucky 3-2 198 15 20. Ohio 2-1 140 18 21. Appalachian State 2-1 139 23 22. Northern Iowa 1-2 132 9 23. North Texas 2-1 126 21 24. North Dakota State 3-1 107 25 24. South Dakota State 3-0 92 NR OTHERS RECEIVING VOTES: Pacific 75, Coastal Carolina 68, Fairfield 60, UALR 60, Siena 55, Bradley 49, UC Santa Barbara 44, Morehead State 42, Vermont 41, Stephen F Austin 40, American 36, IPFW 30, Wright State 29, Sam Houston State 27, Weber State 26, Montana State 25, Akron 23, Harvard 22, Lipscomb 20, Cornell 19, VMI 16, Detroit 14, Davidson 13, Morgan State 12, Green Bay 12, Long Beach State 10, Robert Morris 10, Western Carolina 10, Texas Southern 9, East Tennessee State 8, Belmont 7, Austin Peay 6, Campbell 5, Northeastern 5, Illionis State 4, Long Island 2, Wisconsin Milwaukee 2.
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Post by vuweathernerd on Nov 23, 2010 17:27:18 GMT -5
we ever so briefly picked up some votes. maybe some more after tonight's game if we can pull it out?
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Post by milanmiracle on Nov 25, 2010 9:04:37 GMT -5
we ever so briefly picked up some votes. maybe some more after tonight's game if we can pull it out? I guess having A D1 win would certainly help.
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Post by vuweathernerd on Nov 25, 2010 11:55:05 GMT -5
maybe we'll leave vegas with one
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Post by agibson on Nov 30, 2010 4:03:04 GMT -5
Yeah, beating Ohio might indeed have got us a vote or two. These things seem like a pretty inwardly focused phenomena. When teams lose they move down, lower teams move up. To break into the business, beating one of the ranked teams seems to help.
Busy week in the poll this week. Butler falls to 7th! Cleveland State passes them, rising to 5th. Loyola climbs to 10th (the pollsters really like wins, and especially undefeated teams) and picks up a first place vote! As for other past and potential Valpo opponents, Ohio and Oakland are still hanging around.
Updated Nov 29. 1. Old Dominion (19) 4-1 738 3 2. Gonzaga (6) 3-2 709 1 3. St. Mary's (1) 6-1 702 5 4. Wichita State (4) 3-1 677 4 5. Cleveland State 7-0 647 7 6. VCU 4-1 594 8 7. Butler 3-2 549 2 8. Missouri State 4-2 502 9 9. George Mason 4-2 469 10 10. Loyola (Chicago) (1) 7-0 453 14 11. Kent State 6-1 403 16 12. Murray State 3-3 391 6 13. Creighton 4-2 359 13 14. Oakland 3-3 345 12 15. North Texas 4-1 275 23 16. Rider 4-2 220 15 17. South Dakota State 5-0 201 25 18. Portland 5-2 197 17 19. Ohio 4-2 187 20 20. Northern Iowa 2-2 165 22 21. Vermont 4-1 145 NR 22. College of Charleston 4-3 140 18 23. Appalachian State 2-2 118 21 24. Hampton 5-1 94 NR 25. Coastal Carolina 6-2 90 NR OTHERS RECEIVING VOTES: Western Kentucky 81, James Madison 75, Pacific 66, Harvard 45, Wofford 44, Illinois State 36, Morehead State 34, American 33, Evansville 28, Stephen F Austin 27, Sam Houston State 26, Fairfield 24, VMI 24, Bradley 22, North Dakota State 22, Weber State 22, Montana State 19, Siena 17, Portland State 13, UC Santa Barbara 13, Belmont 11, Jacksonville 11, Morgan State 10, Detroit 9, Akron 8, Long Beach State 6, Davidson 5, UT Arlington 5, Arkansas-Little Rock 3,UMKC 3, Buffalo 1, Long Island 1, North Florida 1.
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Post by agibson on Dec 7, 2010 5:19:26 GMT -5
Beating a "ranked" team does indeed help. But not quite enough. Valpo picks up votes in spades, but it's only good for the first "also ran", #26.
And, what can you say, the voters really like wins! CSU, as the only remaining undefeated in the rankings, climbs to a solid #1. Butler wallows at #8. Loyola tumbles to #21 on losses to Butler and Valpo. Detroit hangs in amongst the "also rans" with 9 votes.
Ohio falls to Marshall and out of the top-25. Oakland beats a weak UMKC and hangs around at #12 - they have an absolutely brutal schedule in the next weeks before we're likely to play them. Three ranked teams (not mid-majors!) and Michigan.
1. Cleveland State (23) 10-0 744 5 2. Gonzaga (2) 4-3 702 2 3. Old Dominion (3) 5-2 699 1 4. St. Mary's (1) 6-2 674 3 5. Wichita State (1) 5-2 649 4 6. Missouri State 6-2 584 8 7. George Mason 6-2 555 9 8. Butler (1) 4-3 507 7 9. VCU 5-2 462 6 10. North Texas 7-1 451 15 11. Kent State 7-2 406 11 12. Oakland 5-3 373 14 13. Portland 7-2 363 18 14. Vermont 6-1 307 21 15. College of Charleston 6-3 262 22 16. Northern Iowa 4-2 229 20 17. South Dakota State 6-1 196 17 18. Drexel 5-1 191 NR 19. Morehead State 5-3 177 NR 20. Murray State 4-4 161 12 21. Loyola (Chicago) 7-2 159 10 22. Coastal Carolina 7-2 158 25 23. Hampton 7-1 134 24 24. Creighton 4-4 129 13 25. Harvard 5-3 104 NR OTHERS RECEIVING VOTES: Valparaiso 94, Appalachian State 55, Ohio 53, Rider 47, Wofford 45, Jacksonville 39, Illinois State 37, James Madison 36, American 25, Fairfield 24, Pacific 24, Bradley 23, North Dakota State 22, Weber State 22, Montana State 19, Stephen F Austin 17, Portland State 13, UC Santa Barbara 13, Belmont 11, Delaware 10, IPFW 10, Sam Houston State 10, Detroit 9, Akron 8, New Hampshire 8, Lipscomb 6, Long Beach State 6, Northern Arizona 6, Davidson 5, Evansville 5, UT Arlington 5, Princeton 4, Arkansas Little Rock 3, Florida Atlantic 1, Iona 1, Oral Roberts 1.
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Post by agibson on Dec 13, 2010 4:50:09 GMT -5
With the loss to Toledo's, Valpo's shot at a position in the mid-major top 25 is probably deferred. We had finished just outside the top spots (maybe 11th?) in Whelliston's basketball state mid-major rankings, but that's probably gone too, for now.
Cleveland State has actually picked up some votes in the AP poll - which Butler's stopped doing. If they manage to beat West Virginia, who's picking up some votes in the ESPN coach's poll, they might well pick up a national ranking.
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Post by agibson on Dec 20, 2010 8:19:42 GMT -5
Deferred indeed. We fell down even below IPFW (that should change after Saturday's result).
Still three Horizon teams hanging around the top 25.
UPDATED: Dec. 13, 2010
1. Cleveland State (27) 12-0 770 1 2. Old Dominion (2) 8-2 728 3 3. St. Mary's 7-2 703 4 4. Gonzaga (1) 4-5 682 2 5. Wichita State (1) 6-2 600 5 6. George Mason 8-2 593 7 7. Missouri State 6-3 568 6 8. Butler 5-4 533 8 9. VCU 6-3 490 9 10. North Texas 8-2 454 10 11. Kent State 8-3 414 11 12. Oakland 5-5 394 12 13. College of Charleston 7-3 356 15 14. Portland 8-3 332 13 15. Drexel 6-1 293 18 16. Vermont 7-2 263 14 17. Northern Iowa 5-3 219 16 18. South Dakota State 7-2 217 17 19. Harvard 7-2 198 25 20. Morehead State 6-4 193 19 21. Murray State 5-4 173 20 22. Coastal Carolina 7-2 116 22 23. Creighton 5-4 114 24 24. Iona 7-3 68 NR 25. Loyola (Chicago) 8-3 59 21 OTHERS RECEIVING VOTES: Illinois State 47, James Madison 38, Belmont 38, Fairfield 37, Princeton 36, Hampton 33, North Dakota State 32, Ohio 30, Jacksonville 24, Quinnipiac 19, Florida Atlantic 15, Portland State 15, American 14, IPFW 14, Northern Arizona 13, Lipscomb 12, Stephen F Austin 12, Wofford 12, Valparaiso 11, VMI 11, Delaware 10, Davidson 9, Detroit 9, Weber State 9, Akron 8, Montana State 7, Furman 6, UNC Wilmington 6, UT Arlington 5, Yale 5, UC Santa Barbara 4, Oral Roberts 2, Buffalo 1, Columbia 1.
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